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TOPIC: There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol

There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18507

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I wish they would take off the no link addition on this forum so Kratom related stuff can grow I want to post about Kratom Chronicles a great podcast on this forum but you can't drop any links but I really appreciate your comments me and thank you your words do mean a lot to me especially you Gman thanks so much for watching and commenting. What's your YouTube username?
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18509

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My youtube user name is Grant dumas
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18514

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gmantheman wrote: My youtube user name is Grant dumas


You just made my night brother :D
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18534

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Have you seen Carpo 719's channel? This morning he put a video called Dear Indonesian; you are not Maeng Da.
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18535

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That's funny! Keep me posted on any newsy updates about kratom legality, the fight in TENNESSEE/KENTUCKY, AKA stuff (if that stuff gets air time)? Thanks

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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18653

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"fine ass hoe" lol im never gonna think of the words Maeng Da the same....... :S The info about super strains makes sense though, I have noticed i didnt need quite as much of these strains, i guess that would be because they have been filtered and stuff.
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18727

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I posted the article on thekratomforum and this was the response of one of the vendors there:

Take an oak tree and make cuttings out of it. Plant them in different regions of Texas. Notice the physical differences between the trunks, branches, and leaves. It doesn't matter what you call those different trees, but they are all still oak. However, because soil (microbes variations too) and climate is different, the trees can pass as different types/strains/variants of oak trees. The profiles of any tree grown in different soil/climates will be different, and that's the beauty. The name doesn't matter at all. What matters is quality, and the vendors should all know that. A name only means something to the customer IF the subsequent harvests of the same name are consistent in quality/profile.

Many years ago, "Maeng Da" has always been known as the leaf which had deep ribbed veins with spiked tips. It looks horned. What's confusing is when you see a vendor or exporter offering both "Maeng Da" and "Horned"! That's when my marketing-BS meter sounds off.

The name does not matter. "Bali" means nothing to me except it has been known as a branding. Some leaf from Indonesia called "Thai" or "Malay" isn't from those countries either (odd how the writer didn't say anything about that), but the harvesters (if honest) along the border indeed see physical differences between various Mitragyna speciosa trees. Some sources over there are not going to tell you certain answers that may even remotely evidence some harvests being brought over from Malaysia or Thailand for very good reasons. Yes, there are some secrets, but the system isn't broken, and it works as long as stateside vendors and sources are consistently honest. Unfortunately, many vendors have been lazy and simply put up a random harvest as "Bali" just to fill a void in their product menu. That would be a more suitable subject to write about, or perhaps how white vein and green vein are often considered the same by harvesters. I'm not going to dispute the fact that the Maeng Da I've offered clearly has a different physical appearance in the crushed leaf form the non-Maeng Da harvests. I've found nicely preserved whole leaves that are very uniquely different in those harvests! The writer is likely not a miller.
The vendor is called entheo farm
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18735

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gmantheman wrote: I posted the article on thekratomforum and this was the response of one of the vendors there:

Take an oak tree and make cuttings out of it. Plant them in different regions of Texas. Notice the physical differences between the trunks, branches, and leaves. It doesn't matter what you call those different trees, but they are all still oak. However, because soil (microbes variations too) and climate is different, the trees can pass as different types/strains/variants of oak trees. The profiles of any tree grown in different soil/climates will be different, and that's the beauty. The name doesn't matter at all. What matters is quality, and the vendors should all know that. A name only means something to the customer IF the subsequent harvests of the same name are consistent in quality/profile.

Many years ago, "Maeng Da" has always been known as the leaf which had deep ribbed veins with spiked tips. It looks horned. What's confusing is when you see a vendor or exporter offering both "Maeng Da" and "Horned"! That's when my marketing-BS meter sounds off.

The name does not matter. "Bali" means nothing to me except it has been known as a branding. Some leaf from Indonesia called "Thai" or "Malay" isn't from those countries either (odd how the writer didn't say anything about that), but the harvesters (if honest) along the border indeed see physical differences between various Mitragyna speciosa trees. Some sources over there are not going to tell you certain answers that may even remotely evidence some harvests being brought over from Malaysia or Thailand for very good reasons. Yes, there are some secrets, but the system isn't broken, and it works as long as stateside vendors and sources are consistently honest. Unfortunately, many vendors have been lazy and simply put up a random harvest as "Bali" just to fill a void in their product menu. That would be a more suitable subject to write about, or perhaps how white vein and green vein are often considered the same by harvesters. I'm not going to dispute the fact that the Maeng Da I've offered clearly has a different physical appearance in the crushed leaf form the non-Maeng Da harvests. I've found nicely preserved whole leaves that are very uniquely different in those harvests! The writer is likely not a miller.
The vendor is called entheo farm


This is a great response. I actually just had a conversation about taking Thai and Malay off my menu. Great READ. He is very right.

It is a fact that vendors don't tell the truth. It's now our job (this man and myself) to weed out these lies. I am willing to take a stand.

I am discontinuing all supposed Thai and Malay as of tomorrow. I have been contemplating this but now I will do it.

I have even told my vendor I don't believe him when he says he gets these strains from illegal territories. I don't believe it any more. I am not going to be a part of these lies that have been turned into main stream.

I am going to contact my vendor and threaten a disconnect if he doesn't tell me which region the leaf really came from.

It's time to make everyone become consistent.

Now the article can be named, there is no Thai, Malay, or Maeng Da.

It still remains that Maeng Da doesn't exist. Those specifications he gives for Maeng Da leafs might be right in certain circumstances, but to be certain that you have Maeng Da is absurd.

No farmer that I know mills true maeng da.

And, to his comment about milling whites more than gree... it is true. Green isn't really a vein. I don't see how his comment about me milling kratom has any grounds. I am close with many millers. But, I will not pretend to know that I know where maeng da comes from. I won't tell you it's a specific leaf... because that would be a lie. I know many millers and this guy seems like he knows the only millers around and he seems like he's one of those people that knows it all and isn't willing to learn along the way. Explaining maeng da as a horned ribbed red vein is ridiculous. There are many horned ribbed red veins out there. It's just another person claiming to know something that has no constant. His explanation of maeng da from years ago is absurd. His standards of maeng da comes from his circle. Which, at the looks of his reply is probably pretty small. Especially if he assumes as much as he does.

I'm sure that he knows a lot. But, claiming what maeng da used to be is absolutely ridiculous. I have a huge network of farmers I talk to from about 4 different islands. Maeng Da comes from many different sources and leaves. Just as he explained with his oak tree example. For him to claimed that he knew where maeng da used to come from is pretty bold. But, I guess he knows the leaf that no one else seems to know.

I would love to read more of his thoughts but not at the expense of so much assumption. According to his response... he knows the physical traits of maeng da AND he knows that I have no knowledge of milling. He lost his credibility a little bit when attacking the source of an unbias article. He obviously has bias.

But, I do agree with him about Malay and Thai. I just can't see him knowing the traits of Maeng Da years ago and his words insinuating it has changed. Maybe there was no consistency ever, and his small circle of kratom supplies told him that. If it was that easy to define maeng da then there would be consistency. People that know for a fact about stuff like that prove my point that misinformation is spewed out.

Maeng Da is NOT just horned red vein. That's just not the truth. It's his speculation.

I can't agree that he knows something nobody else does. He really just told us his opinion and bit was just that... opinion.. because he gave Maeng Da a very vague definition. Which proves my point!
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18736

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And he also insinuated that strain names are based off of characteristics..

When he said this:
. A name only means something to the customer IF the subsequent harvests of the same name are consistent in quality/profile.

So he is basically saying that the region HAS to be a name of the leaf only if it is consistent in effects ... so if someone grew a Sulawesi that feels like a "bali" then he would fill out his menu with the name Bali bc it didn't have traits of a Sulawesi.

What if the subsequent harvest of the same tree weren't consistent in quality and profile? What then? His logic goes out the window and he proves the point that vendors lie to sell to customers.

Grant, you know the red strain we were talking about? If he were the vendor I think based off his logic he would have sold you a sedating strain and just slapped a name on it. But, you know for a fact that red didn't fit the characteristics of a normal red. It was in fact more like a greenish red traits. So, he is basically admitting what I'm trying to convey.

I believe he is saying that all vendors do is search for traits and slap a name that people wanna hear. You know from personal experience. I gave you a red from a region I know my vendor got it. I am pretty sure about most of my strains . It happened to not be consistent in red traits. That's bc the strain comes from a location NOT just because it is a certain quality/profile. He is basically saying that strains have to have consistency to be a certain name. That's not the case. Like he mentioned each tree is different. He is contradicting himself. He says that a strain has to be consistent ... But that's not what nature says. He also started out his post saying that all trees are different. He is pretty much the reason why everyone lies about strains. Just bc this guy feels like a Bali is supposed to be a certain way doesn't mean people should lie. I'm confused at his point honestly.
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There Is No Maeng Da...Anywhere. By Joe Sokol 1 year 6 months ago #18738

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I just posted that article there to see the reactions. Of course everyone praises the Entheo Farm Vendor (Red Vein). Regarding Thai's and Malay's where do you think these strains really come from? Red Thais have a unique characteristic most of the time as being more stimulating than other reds. I have always wondered why is that.
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