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TOPIC: Kratom and my life

Kratom and my life 7 months 3 weeks ago #33576

  • getspent
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I'm new here... I have been on the forums in the past a couple months but only just registered.

Here is my background:
38, male, married, 4 kids
About 10 years ago I went through a tough spot in life developed PTSD type symptoms
Went to 15-20 different docs over teh past decade looking for relief - from western medicine to OMD's to naturapaths, chiro's, neurologists, and more more more...

My main complaints:
Jaw pain (lower mandible - not TMJ joints)
shoulder/neck pain
Fatigue
Fragmented sleep (caused by pain)
Depression (caused by the above)

Medications have been previously:
up to 4mg/day clonozapam for spasms, sleep, anxity
up to 60mg/day baclofen (RX is for 80) for spasms, pain
up to 20mg Dexedrine for fatigue and concentration, although I wouldnt classify myself as ADHD
up to 200units of botox in the neck, shoulders, jaw for spasms (closely related to "Cervical Dystonia)
Vybriid SSRI antideppresants (have been on about 8 different ones, this one worked best for me)
to many sleeping pills/types to name (including off label meds like Trazadone, Seroquel, etc)

Those are the nasty meds... NSAID's do nothing for the type of pain. I have been so fortunate to never been on opiods except a couple surgeries.... I cant handle them I take 1 Lortab or Percacet and I wont poop for 3 days...


There are other meds too, but i cannot remember them all...

Where I am at in life:

In the past couple years I was introduced to CBD oil by my really good doctor, a doctor that costs $500/hour to consult with and is a world renowned specialist for chronic pain and fatigue. He has been very helpful in my journey. He is supportive of both medication + alternative remedy's and lifestyle changes.

I have also read the "Dirty Genes" book and have a good understanding as to why I am the way i am (how i'm wired).

I'm a business owner and very very motivated deep within myself to be successful...

For most people around me, they dont know any of the above... I keep it all internal, and fight through the fatigue and put on a face. One year alone my health costs were over $35000 between insurance+doc visits+botox+supplements+medications ...


Now onto what I was saying....

Botox only got me about 60% better...
CBD Oil for me has fully replaced botox, so i dont need botox anymore. But it also only gets me about 60% better.
CBD also helped me taper off Dexedrine...

Also I was suggested to try a 50/50 CBD/THC combo... this for me helps me sleep and helps alot with pain.

I found out about Kratom just a few months ago. I first tried it about 1.5 grams of "Horizon Wholesale" brand - very expensive from local herb/nutrition store and I was amazed. I have since been a student of the herb.

I have since ordered small packages of about 80% of Happy Hippo Herbals Kratom products. (in other words, i have in my cupboard nearly every HHH product for evaluation).

Just through the trial period, i have easily eliminated the SSRI. I have also decreased Clonozapam to 1mg/day. I have also descreased Baclofen to 10mg/day.

The changes it has given me have been nothing short of a miracle...

I also take a hefty protocol of vitamins/supplements based on whole food (not vitamin isolates) with the goal to rebuild my gut (I have been working on Gut health for 5+ years and am a believer that all health resides in the gut)

with that said... This is my struggle:

I have never drank alcohol or done any drugs... But I have a dependance type personality in the sense that I just want a SCHEDULE/SOLUTION that I am confident in and believe it will work.

1. I beat myself up still over the fact that I need something to be my best self...
2. I am hesitant to try anything different or new in most situations because I have a family and work and have a hard time finding time to experiment.
3. I probably dont take enough to get the full benefit


What I would REALLY LOVE:...

I have practically memorized Happy Hippos FAQ - talking about Fast / Medium / Slow...

But the thing that it DOESNT DO is say what will be good for pain. Also there are some White's that are "SLOW" and even a RED that is "FAST"...

So its confusing to me...

I have read the post titled "Welcome to the World of Kratom. I will be your Guide" in the forum that discusses in depth alot of what I am looking for. But its still so broad.

I would like a separate illustration showing what strains and their colors and what their levels of the different alkaloids are - namely the pain relieving ones. Or some sort of interactive matrix.

I've got to think this exists??

For example... "Red Horned Kratom" generally is "SLOW" and Good/average/bad for PAIN, has THESE potential negative effects, ETC ETC...

So from the vendor HHH Hulu Hippo is "SLOW" but I am under the assumption that it will NOT help with pain since its a white, not a red.

Thanks for reading every body - just wondering if something like this exists...

And also any support/reassurance you can throw my way that Kratom IS good and "HEALTHY"... I mean, isnt taking Kratom for a headache even better for you then OTC Ibruprofren....?...

Those are the mental battles I experience.

I am very up and down and its partly caused by Kratom... but the thing is, I have not been "UP" in so many years that I want to STAY UP now that I have FELT UP.

So finding a rotation that works for me is what I really want.

So far I am averaging about 10 total grams per day, divided in 2-4 doses- but again, i will try to extend as long as I can for fear of dependence.

I hope this all makes sense.


I also want to throw out there that Kratom has allowed me to work out harder and play ball more often... I have found that White Borneo + Green MD + some Red Malay (1.5g+.7g+.7g) is an amazing pre-sport mix and has given me some of the best workouts that i have ever had.


For example right now Im headed to family for the holidays and I want to feel good but not be sedated. Reds do sedate me but i dont know if its because my body is already fatigued from poor sleep.


ALSO - I have been scared to try a RED for sleep, because the few times i have taken 2-3 grams at night its kept me awake. But i read that you need 5+ grams for sleep. I'm hesitant about this... But if i could get off even more medication and enhance my sleep quality it would be amazing.

Lastly - wondering what options are best for LONGER LASTING... as I have an extremely fast metabolism... it seems like most times I benefit from Kratom, it only lasts 2-3 hours.

thanks in advance... i know my post here is "all over the place" but if anybody has any thoughts feel free to share :)


Thanks!!!
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Kratom and my life 7 months 3 weeks ago #33578

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I'm going through some similar stuff and issues. This group has been super supportive and will be kind and help you through this. I had to laugh when you said you had a cabinet full of random kinds of Kratom. cause mine looks exactly the same. One thing I'm going to try is keeping a journal. about the different effects. I'm interested in following this vein. Welcome my friend.
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Kratom and my life 7 months 3 weeks ago #33580

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Hello welcome to the forum.
You have tried kratom and know you lowest working dose.
You found one online vendor.
Happy Hippo is on the pricier side.(they are not an approved forum vendor but they have good reviews here) I do not find the labels slow, fast, moderate helpful.
Look through the approved vendor list
www.ilovekratom.com/kratom-vendors

look through the reviews
www.ilovekratom.com/forum/kratom-vendors
www.ilovekratom.com/forum/rate-a-vendor

My recent vendor buys are from
Approved vendors
In Sense/Goldleaf Botanicals
Pa Botanicals
Re-leaf llc (reopening very soon)
Canopy

Off the list but well reviewed-
Herbal RVA, Socal herbal remedies- budget friendly accepting paypal
Inland Botanicals- forum favorite

All the above have reviews here and are priced about $20-29 for about 4oz.

I post this because quality sources of Kratom is first.

Also look through this guide it mentions strains and uses
www.ilovekratom.com/forum/kratom-discuss...-oldies#.XCQXBVxKiUn


To answer a few of your questions. Alway remember Kratom is subjective and can work differently for each individual. Its best to have a scale for actuate dosing, preventing tolerance,staying with lowest working dose.

what will be good for pain

Starters
Red Borneo, Red Bali, Red Sumatra, Red Hulu

Most Red strains are best for pain. Most can lean sedating and are very good night strains. Red or Royal Bentuangies I find most sedating, muscle relaxing.

Most Reds have at least 4 hour duration and more for me.

White strains for me do not manage pain as well. The duration is too short for me to use for pain management, and most whites are like a strong energizing cup of coffee

I take Kratom for spinal arthritis. Kratom has excellent anti inflammatory properties often overlooked. You will no long ever need to take an NSAID. I have to mention I take 2 grams of turmeric twice a day usually with my Kratom.

I can use Green strains to manage pain and they have the best anxiety relief in general. I had to experiment more to find greens that managed pain well and had duration.
These are Green Borneo, Green Hulu, Green Thai,
Re-leaf llc( I mention vendor re-leaf because they label differently) Green Sundra, Green Kali.

I have been trying Yellow Strains lately and finding good relief.

I take only Greens during the day and only Reds at nights.

lol seems my answers are all over the place.
Check out the links, please ask any questions missing or needs further details.

We have forum member who can address some more of your health issues. Hopefully you will get more replies soon.

Common Kratom tips. Have a scale. Stay hydrated, Manage constipation with good diet, magnesium citrate supplements or your choice of management.
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Kratom and my life 7 months 3 weeks ago #33581

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I have been scared to try a RED for sleep


some Reds like Hulu are good pain reliving but give me energy. I would try a Red Bentuangie, or Red Borneo.

So finding a rotation that works for me is what I really want.


comes with time and note taking

Im headed to family for the holidays and I want to feel good but not be sedated.


Try a Green strain or White/ Red mix.

And also any support/reassurance you can throw my way that Kratom IS good and "HEALTHY"... I mean, isnt taking Kratom for a headache even better for you then OTC Ibruprofren....?...


There is so much misinformation out htere about Kratom. Having a good source/trusted vendor, Kratom is safe.

Visit here for more inforamtion
www.americankratom.org/
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Kratom and my life 7 months 3 weeks ago #33587

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Welcome to the best kratom forum ever, Getspent!

You have uncovered every flaw in the leaf’s abilities.

It cannot become predictable for you. It cannot guarantee it will last longer for you. It CAN give you constipation, so if lortabs did that to you, you’ll want a serious routine for managing the tubes.

The leaf is not magic and won’t fix everything. It won’t eliminate life’s challenges, but it’s a helluva great tool.

I’m not trying to sound so snotty.

Those things you think it “must do”. It doesn’t.

Never will.

Also, as one who cannot sleep from ANY DOSE, you may want to skip it for sleep. I also get insomnia and THINK ALL NIGHT no matter HOW MUCH I TAKE. There are many of us who cannot use kratom in evenings.

You’ve discovered most all the stuff it helps with already. It’s a tool to allow us to further work on getting as much quality out of this life as possible.

You’re already experiencing the wonders of what it CAN DO. You’re on your own to “fix the rest” alternatively.

And the FAST, SLOW stuff means nada here.

ILK VENDORS have not adopted that labeling system and THEY WOULD IF IT WERE HELPFUL AND APPLICABLE, but one thing you can count on is you cannot COUNT ON kratom being the same EACH DAY, either. Or even helpful each day!

Sometimes it becomes virtually useless and you end up on the couch, full of powder and miserable.

I hope you can learn to have ONE unpredictable thing in your life because I think this is STILL the biggest miracle for you, me and millions of others.

Wait until you see what a sample area looks like after a few YEARS of this. That’s PART OF IT. It’s not fun to have bags of less than helpful powder hanging around. But those bags, if sealed and stored properly, might become your favorite strain six months from now (approx) as our metabolism changes.

Every dang day is an experiment and we are not guaranteed anything.
That is something you must learn to accept while using plant material subject to soil conditions and weather MANY MILES from here. Plus drying different ways, packing and shipping is ALL different and affects the leaf. Our ILK vendors also have it lab tested and checked for contamination before selling it (hence higher prices).

Welcome to the group! There’s still more to learn and try if you make time.

Congratulations on ALL YOU'VE DISCOVERED.

Next you’ll discover the Big Pharma manufacturers want to discontinue our access to this leaf NOW because they aren’t making money on the leaf.
Check out our advocacy group at www.americankratom.org for how much help we need to be able to access the leaf long term.

We can use an advocate like you to help us keep it legally accessible to all.
Laurie
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Kratom and my life 7 months 3 weeks ago #33597

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Getspent-
Thought you might find madmaxnightrider's post of interest. Worth the while to search through his posts.
Discusses alkaloids-
www.ilovekratom.com/forum/plain-leaf-kra...nfo-on-strains#24952

Laurie summed up kratom very well. We cannot ask kratom to have always the same alkaloid profile and then take it and it will do the same exact thing every day.
But I still find it reliable for managing my spinal arthritis. Its not my only tool but its by far the best tool I have.
I found a good balanced routine/strain rotation/vendor rotation that works for me, I have been taking Kratom now just over a year.
My pain levels are controlled, mental health is better, I found a few additional management herbs to booster or supplement any Kratom fail. (incarvillea sinesis and Chuchuhuasi, and I very much want to try Corydalis next)
I can sympathize, I've been there, but I no longer put any time in worrying about needing help - 1. I beat myself up still over the fact that I need something to be my best self...
Search member posts from BoMalley. She is a retired nurse from Canada and has great insight about this.

Wishing everyone well this evening.

Also useful in wondering about Kratom's safety profile
AKA has two Facebook groups are excellent in addressing concern.
Kratom Consumer Advocacy and Support
www.facebook.com/groups/PROACTIVE2/

American Kratom Association
www.facebook.com/Americankratomassociati...VKns&fref=nf&__xts__
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Kratom and my life 7 months 2 weeks ago #33676

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Welcome to the ILK Forum getspent. Thanks for sharing as they say! Sounds like your going through it right now. I can tell you there is nothing & will never be nothing to rival what Kratom can do for people with Pain, Depression & Anxiety. Kratom tackles all these problems & more. There is nothing out there that does so much. Kratom shines when you mix different strains together. You are actually creating a new strain with a completely different alkaloid profile when you make a new blend with several strains.

I wouldn't worry about dependence. I have been on the same dose for the past several years now & it still works the same as when I started that dose. Kratom will still work even if you take it 5 times a day 7 days a week although the effects will be diminished slightly because of how often it is being taken but it will still work & you won't have to keep upping your dose like you would with any medicine. Less is More with Kratom.
If anybody has any Questions about Kratom please private message me or make a Post & I will be glad to answer as soon as I can usually within 24 hours if not sooner. I'm usually on really late at night Between Midnight & 5am.
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Kratom and my life 7 months 2 weeks ago #33686

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I disagree about dependence. There is a dependance issue, both physical and mental. It’s nothing like opiate addiction. Addiction and dependence are different.

Many people take breaks from kratom to assure they do not become dependent on kratom. It’s probably more of a psychological dependence because a certain bit of placebo effect is included- no extra charge.

Many people think they will just DIE if they miss their dose. Then they forget to take it and realize they didn’t die. Nor did they collapse into pain 3 hours after the last dose. In fact they are FINE. I definitely have minor discomfort most mornings that are partially from not having taken kratom all night. So it does have minor addictive alkaloids (there is a lot of documentation on this).
I find the minor discomfort quite minimal compared to my other physical problems upon waking. I do not wake in the night to take kratom to PREVENT this discomfort, but quitting altogether would be uncomfortable for a couple, maybe 3 days after daily use for at least a few years now.

Hopefully that helps you determine where you want to go with your kratom use. It’s a wonderful plant/leaf.
Laurie
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Kratom and my life 7 months 2 weeks ago #33687

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Thanks to all for the posts so far. It's been more helpful then all the hours I've spent researching. I placed orders with inland Botanicals and in sense last week and got the new stuff on Saturday. I'll post what I got and reviews of them after a few days. Meantime I just wanted to say thanks for all the awesome input so far and I hope to contribute back as well. Happy new year ill send more details when I have more time in a few days!
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Kratom and my life 7 months 2 weeks ago #33688

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Funny you mention in sense a package just showed up at my door from them. this is my 2nd order with them. overall happy with my 1st order.

I look forward to my morning kratom because it is one of the best doses of the day with a nice cup of coffee. Also I'm not looking at the clock in a hurry to take my morning dose of kratom like i did with opiates.
I do wake up with an urgent need for a bowel movement since kratom binds you up throughout the day. But nothing like the sickening GI issues from opiates.
I've had stomach issues my whole life so kratom binding up my stomach is a good thing. I dont get constipated either. Some of it may also have to do with the anti anxiety and calming effect from the kratom.
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