07 Feb 2019
Hey everybody,

Over the last 7 years this forum has grown exponentially. With your help, We have created a community of Kratom enthusiasts to come together and discuss the industry. The traffic that this site has received has been exciting but also overwhelming. All the while the site grew a little out of date. Over the last few weeks we have updated the platform of the Forum as well as the face of the forum. CHECK OUT THAT NEW LOGO!!! sweet right?!


We could use your help though...
Read More...
General discussions regarding Kratom and related topics.
(No Vendor or Promotional Material Please)
  • Page:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4

TOPIC: Is that even possible???

Is that even possible??? 5 months 2 hours ago #38951

  • Littlebear3
  • Littlebear3's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Expert Boarder
  • Expert Boarder
  • Posts: 89
  • Karma: 15
  • Thank you received: 278
If someone develops that kind of addiction to Kratom, they are chasing a high and it would have been something. If the kid could not get Kratom, it might have been alcohol.

Kratom shots? I can't imagine it. I like Kratom and it has helped me a lot, but I have no desire to get wiped out on it or anything else. But someone chasing a high will find it somewhere.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Laurie, Tiggermanscrat, Robie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Is that even possible??? 5 months 19 minutes ago #38962

  • jayisk
  • jayisk's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Gold Boarder
  • Gold Boarder
  • Posts: 190
  • Karma: 15
  • Thank you received: 481
if people want to get high they will find a way. kratom shots are the issue in most of these propaganda stories. yet this is limited to head shops, gas stations, and online.

Now you can go into any store and buy mouthwash or hand sanitizer and get drunk off that.
there are OTC pills that if you take enough you will get a real high similar to oxy's.
there is a way to make an OTC into an amphetamine.
again this are cheaper ways and also easy and legal to purchase at any store.

i am not suggesting anyone try something as dumb as this because by doing so you can get srs health issues or die. this OTC products were not meant to be taken to get a high from but people still risk their life and do so.
Hell a bottle of NyQuil can put someone out for the night.

Again my point is there will always be people that have substance abuse issues and will use whatever they can to get some type of high or buzz.

Kratom has to sought after to buy. and if you are just using plain kratom powder you will not get any type of opiate high or buzz from it. it is the only current positive tool for helping to get off opiates or for chronic pain issues. Which it is appalling when dr's take patients off their pain meds that they have taken as prescribed for yrs. Because drs are so scared they force pts to go cold turkey or lower the amount that they have been taken to almost nothing.
And they claim it is so they dont get addicted. Great a poor soul that is on pain meds.., which most dont want to be on in the first place but it is the only way they can function in daily life. Is now forced to suffer even though they are not abusing their meds.
So some have actually could not find any other solution and took their own lives.

sadly kratom and other natural botanical s could have helped these suffering people. But the corrupt government spearheaded by the FDA is trying its best to ban kratom and there propaganda in the media makes it sound worse then heroin or fentanyl. All with nothing based off of science or truth.

its truly sickening how this corrupt government and the 1% that run the U.S. have no regard for the health and well being of the average citizen. Oh your water is full of lead.., here just use bottled water. and we are not going to fix the infrastructures to allow you to have clean water. This isnt happening in a 3rd world country..., it is right here we they claim to be the greatest country ever. Well karma will eventually catch up to this s-bags and there is a special place in hell for them.

this is my dilemma..,trying not to think about how corrupt and wrong things are and focus on the positive. kratom is helping me with that but i just get so pissed off sometimes that they get away with treating their own people this way.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Laurie, Tiggermanscrat, Robie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by jayisk.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 4 weeks ago #38984

  • Tiggermanscrat
  • Tiggermanscrat's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Platinum Boarder
  • AKA Don
  • Posts: 563
  • Karma: 10
  • Thank you received: 1323
This thread’s heading seemed appropriate for this recent news article from the DOJ.

www.justice.gov/opa/pr/michigan-man-sent...ing-misbranded-drugs

The man was sentenced to 2 years for selling kratom in a state where it is legal. (Michigan)
“We will not tolerate the importation or misbranding of drugs and other products without proper regulatory approvals” said Assistant Attorney General Jody Hunt of the Department of Justice’s Civil Division. “The Department of Justice will continue to work with the FDA to ensure that drug distributors do not put consumers at risk by circumventing their obligations under the Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act.”

It said in the article that he had “illegally imported” the kratom? I don’t understand that since it is legal in that state. :-?
My Grandkids say I’m a cuckoo head. ;)
The following user(s) said Thank You: Laurie, Insense1, Robie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 4 weeks ago #38986

  • Laurie
  • Laurie's Avatar
  • Away
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • Have a better day!
  • Posts: 5538
  • Karma: 92
  • Thank you received: 7281
There must be more to the story. There’s a lot of journalistic reporting facts BUT omitting proper context.

It is still an improvement over flat lying.

I have only heard of this sort of issue occurring in states like ...Alabama (for example). Other cases have involved “illegal importation” by transferring it to/from states in which it is not legal (ridiculous as that IS).

Thanks for posting, Tiggermanscrat!

I see what the “crime” actually is. I’ll highlight it for you and post below this post.
Laurie
The following user(s) said Thank You: Tiggermanscrat, Robie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by Laurie.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 4 weeks ago #38987

  • Laurie
  • Laurie's Avatar
  • Away
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • Have a better day!
  • Posts: 5538
  • Karma: 92
  • Thank you received: 7281
Making MEDICAL CLAIMS: “unapproved claims that it could treat serious diseases and medical conditions”

Here’s the boo boo: “he sold kratom with the intention that it be used as a drug to treat a variety of diseases, including chronic pain, Lyme disease, rheumatoid arthritis, and fibromyalgia”.
Laurie
The following user(s) said Thank You: Insense1, Tiggermanscrat, Robie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 4 weeks ago #38991

  • Tiggermanscrat
  • Tiggermanscrat's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Platinum Boarder
  • AKA Don
  • Posts: 563
  • Karma: 10
  • Thank you received: 1323
I’ve reread the article a couple of times and noted:
“Dailey knowingly and fraudulently portrayed his kratom products to the FDA as “incense,” “paint pigment,” and other substances not intended for human consumption.

Aren’t some of the approved vendors also selling this as “incense”. Should they verify it is ok to do this?
Based on this article I would think the vendors have to be extremely careful in what they state on their sites.

I wonder if it is possible to get any of the actual trial info to be able to put this in context. I’m going to check on the AKA forum to see if anything has been posted there.
My Grandkids say I’m a cuckoo head. ;)
The following user(s) said Thank You: Laurie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 4 weeks ago #39002

  • Laurie
  • Laurie's Avatar
  • Away
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • Have a better day!
  • Posts: 5538
  • Karma: 92
  • Thank you received: 7281
Some vendors DID use the word incense and NO LONGER DO. Because YES, they must be very careful with words. Nowadays, the AKA ( www.americankratom.org ) has developed standards that can safely be followed regarding what labels contain.

You should check out the AKA website about cGMP compliance guidelines for self regulation being implemented in the industry to review what is being provided as helpful suggestions.

ILK vendors have proven to myself and others involved in the approval process that their packaging meets the guidelines. That’s part of what we do during the review process.

The link you sent said he MADE CLAIMS of disease treatment and ILK vendors have known not to do that from Day One.

One vendor referenced incense and was not ILK approved until that was changed - about 2-3 yrs ago.

Definitely read up on the case because it’s illegal to make health claims with ANY herbal or Botanical plant or supplement.

Please let me know if you see disregard to the cGMP guidelines.

Thanks!
Laurie
The following user(s) said Thank You: Tiggermanscrat

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 3 weeks ago #39150

  • Tiggermanscrat
  • Tiggermanscrat's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Platinum Boarder
  • AKA Don
  • Posts: 563
  • Karma: 10
  • Thank you received: 1323
I could not find specifics on americankratom.org for what is acceptable for describing kratom on a vendor site or to someone calling the vendor for information over the phone.

I also read, on the AKA forum, a thread about this man who was arrested. His name is Matt and he was the owner and operator of Nomad Botanicals in Michigan.

Some of the people that posted said they know Matt and that “he truly is a nice guy with all the best intentions for helping people in need, he was not the best businessman nor the most careful.”
“To put this into better perspective, his "medical advice" was given in private communications which I am hoping will serve as a warning to ALL vendors ... nothing you say or communicate in private is truly private.”

“This is a sad truth that ALL of us must realize; kratom vendors as well as kratom consumers. Business is business & no matter how close you are to your clientele, as a vendor you must not allow your business to become overly personal. And to most of us here, as kratom consumers, we must protect our vendors by not putting them in a position of answering questions at their own peril.”
“If he had not given medical advice, even in private communications, he may have been able to beat this.”


Based on some of the posts it sounds like he was giving info over the phone and in emails stating what kratom was best for what ailment.

My only reason for trying to look deeper into this is to protect our approved vendors. I thought I had read in some of the posts here on ILK that our vendors are giving usage suggestions like this over the phone to customers.
I just think that our vendors should be very careful because these people could be pretending to be customers to gather evidence to use against them.

One of our vendors posted the following in that thread on AKA:

“It is truly difficult to turn away, or not answer questions from those who are suffering.
I know this first hand as a vendor, but we can get ourselves in trouble this way.
I did not know this man, but he sounds very familiar in the community.
People with good hearts are everywhere you look and just trying to help.
Until the laws change we as vendors cannot answer any questions and it does hurt those new to kratom.
I just have them go to the forums and ask questions there instead.
God Bless.”
My Grandkids say I’m a cuckoo head. ;)
The following user(s) said Thank You: Laurie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 3 weeks ago #39152

  • Nan70
  • Nan70's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Posts: 1291
  • Karma: 45
  • Thank you received: 3140

people could be pretending to be customers to gather evidence to use against them.

Fe-Dee-A has trolls for sure. It's amazing that this forum hasn't seen them here yet. Sometimes over at reddit kratom you can tell when something isn't quite right with the poster.

Most vendors will protect themselves and not suggest ingestion or dosing. Which is why you will see some reviews that talk about a relaxing "aroma". You cannot claim it the be pain relieving because then its a medicine.
I think you can say something like- this kratom has a nice mood lift. I felt relaxed and did not notice my knees bothering me.
I have written many reviews that just skirted around making any claims that trigger red flags.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Laurie, Tiggermanscrat

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by Nan70.

Is that even possible??? 4 months 3 weeks ago #39153

  • Gibson
  • Gibson's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Junior Boarder
  • Junior Boarder
  • Posts: 37
  • Karma: 10
  • Thank you received: 82
This issue is serious. That’s why I posted a reminder to everyone to not give medical advice and do not ask for or provide personal health information on private messaging.

After I posted that yesterday, oddly, I was “yelled at” on Facebook messenger by a young fellow who has a newborn baby being treated with morphine. He was going OFF about how I banned him and the mother of the baby after giving them the thumbs up to take kratom during pregnancy.
None of this was true, obviously. We take this issue very seriously. He finally asked which forum I’m from (he said he was frantically contacting Admins on various kratom websites out of frustration from being “blocked”). He then referred to screenshots of discussion on another kratom forum and I SAW THE POSTS clearly stating, “it’s fine!” “Go ahead!” and “I used kratom during my entire pregnancy and everything was fine” etc...

Thankfully I didn’t even get remotely concerned about our members possibly having done that because we are not so foolish as to recommend ANY advice on pregnancy. We just have not done that. This was a serious REMINDER that we cannot have such advice being given by ANYONE, not just vendors.

I’d like to take this opportunity to REMIND EVERYONE that it’s NOT RECOMMENDED that private health conditions be shared on private messaging in exchange for advice. We are NOT QUALIFIED to give ANY medical advice and DO NOT provide your health condition on private message in exchange for advice. Do NOT ask for medical advice. It’s NOT acceptable in private messaging or public forum posts.

I didn’t bring this issue to attention because we have not had such activities attempted on ILK. The new father apologized for “yelling” at me about what occurred on another forum entirely (he was desperately anxious to convey his story to those who advised him and the new mother. He also said he accepts some responsibility for taking such advice without thinking it through). This couple was definitely seeking ANYONE who would suggest it would be harmless. BUT they FOUND this advice on a very commonly known kratom discussion forum.

Thank you for bringing the topic up without EVER giving medical advice.

I’m not feeling well this afternoon and this is not my best written material. I can say I’m extremely proud to be a part of this forum. Y’all are wonderful and it was very reassuring to already KNOW he had us confused with another forum.

I will post if I hear any more about how this new family is doing.

Laurie
The following user(s) said Thank You: Laurie, Tiggermanscrat, Barbie

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by Laurie.
  • Page:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
Moderators: kemppaulh
Time to create page: 0.055 seconds

Forum Support

If you're interested in advertising on the site or having any trouble with any function of the forum, please drop us a line.

Contact Us